‘Privacy Nightmare on Wheels’: Every Car Brand Reviewed By Mozilla — Including Ford, Volkswagen and Toyota — Flunks Privacy Test
www.mozillafoundation.org
Mozilla’s latest edition of *Privacy Not Included reveals how 25 major car brands collect and share deeply personal data, including sexual activity, facial expressions, and genetic and health information.
  • Magiilaro@feddit.org
    1·
    3 hours ago

    I never said that it is impossible, but the bureaucratic obstacles are nightmare inducing huge. And the TÜV is the smallest enemy, the end boss would be the Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt for the operating permit.

    Every single open source EV would, by law, need a new certification after every installation of a new or changed software to ensure that it still has all the required assistance systems and security features activated and working correctly. The same for the emissions values and other enviromental protection laws.

    Edit: Hmm, after reading my post i have to say that emissions would not be a problem with an EV 😅

    • B0rax@feddit.org
      1·
      2 hours ago

      This is the same like for closed source. A new software release must be tested and have regression tests that homologation relevant parts are not changed and if they are changed, that they do not violate regulations.

      That’s also one of the reasons why the software has different components. So that you can update the hmi for example without affecting the steering function.

      Going down further that road, there are very specific regulations that cover software updates in particular. There needs to be a software update Management process behind it that makes sure software is only distributed to vehicles that it is designed for.

      But none of that would be more difficult with open source…

      Again, we are not talking about a crowd built vehicle, there still needs to be a manufacturer behind it.

      • Magiilaro@feddit.org
        1·
        2 hours ago

        This is the same like for closed source. A new software release must be tested and have regression tests that homologation relevant parts are not changed and if they are changed, that they do not violate regulations.

        Yes, but with closed software you only have to have those tests and certification done once per version of the software. All installed instances of this version are the same, because only the manufacturer can make changes and sign the software to be installable.

        This is completely different with open source software that can be changed and installed without limitations by every end user/owner of the car. Now the certification has to be done by every single person every time they install a new version to make sure that no forbidden changes were done to the code or the configurations.

        Open Source Software that can be installed freely and unrestricted on a car turns every car into a DIY system, even if it was manufactured by a company

        Going down further that road, there are very specific regulations that cover software updates in particular. There needs to be a software update Management process behind it that makes sure software is only distributed to vehicles that it is designed for.

        Yes, but such a process would be so tight that it more or less produces the same closed system that we have at the moment. One possibility I see would be that the boot loader of the EV is locked and only updates signed by the company can be installed to the car, with the option to send in your changed open source version to have it checked and signed. But this would not be very open source and not really that much more secure then what we have today because you can never be sure that the version you send in for verification and signing is the same that you get back.

        But if you have better Idea the would be true to the open source idea and be compatible with the strong regulations, I would love to read that.

        • B0rax@feddit.org
          1·
          1 hour ago

          Ah, but this is a different discussion. You want to be able to run modified software in a vehicle.

          Then the question becomes an architectural one. Which Software components do you actually want to modify and still be street legal? In theory a modular structure can be build where all homologation and safety relevant limits are fixed and monitor the other non critical components. These non critical components could be changed without needing new homologation (you know, like „apps“).

          You could also make the other ones modifiable with the limitation of losing street legality. So you could only run it on closed tracks or private land. Just like manufacturers do today.

          • Magiilaro@feddit.orgEnglish
            1·
            1 hour ago

            What good would be an open source community EV (that is what the title speaks of) if there is no way for a single person or the community itself to modify and install the code on the EV? You would have no way of knowing that the version running in the car is identical to the source code provided, so having the code would be moot from a security and privacy standpoint.

            Yes, you could put everything concerning street legality into a closed and signed hardware black box, more or less how it is done with the mobile communication hardware in smartphones, but street legality touches so many systems and functions that most of the cars software would be closed. So we are back where we are now.

            For most persons who think about open source they have in mind that they are able to freely install the open source software on their devices, and yes I know that this is not part of the open source definition as written for example in https://opensource.org/osd but IMHO it should be added to it.